Success in sales isn’t just about numbers—it’s about strategy, leadership, and collaboration. In this episode, we dive into the critical role of aligning teams across sales, marketing, and business intelligence to drive revenue growth. Learn how effective leadership, clear communication, and removing internal barriers can set your team up for success.
Whether you're leading a sales team or looking to optimize your sales process, this conversation is packed with insights to help you win. Tune in now! 🎧
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Driving Revenue & Leadership: Aligning Teams For Sales Success With Jake Vernon
I am excited about this episode because this one is with somebody who I have a lot of things in common with. I got Jake Vernon on. He's the Chief Sales Officer for the Minnesota Timberwolves, the Lynx, and the Iowa Wolves. One of the things we have in common is we are both Philly guys. We grew up maybe 4 or 5 miles from each other. We didn't know each other back in the day. I'm a little bit older, but we ran the same areas. Jake, welcome. How are you doing?
Thanks for having me. It is only fitting that you’d have me a week after the Philadelphia Eagles took home a Super Bowl. There's something poetic in that, for sure. I'm sure like me, you were glued to the TV and texting all your crazy Philly friends and family members who were probably out on Broad Street doing stuff that they shouldn't do that night.
It's interesting you brought that up. My mom was having an operation the day after, so I flew into Philly. I got to my brother's house who lives right outside of Philly ten minutes before kickoff. For everybody, my son and his son are about the same age. They’re starting college together. He and I have done therapy together. I have a son who goes to school at St. Joe's in Philly. He's become this massive Philly fan. I didn't want to look at his Instagram. He went from Manayunk to Broad Street. He was in some crowds. I'm like, “I don't want to know,” whatever they were doing.
I was right there with you. I kept picturing my 70-year-old uncles out on the street doing something they shouldn’t do. We go way back when it comes to that Philly connection. We both know how passionate that fan base is. I'm sure they had a good time. It was fun to watch from afar.
There's no doubt. I usually cheer for who we are doing business with. We do some stuff with Kansas City. I'm like, “I can't take the Philly out of me no matter what happens.”
Not at all.
Jake’s Experience As A Chief Sales Officer
Tell everybody about your role. You are the Chief Sales Officer for three professional sports properties. Talk a little bit about the role, how many people report to you, and major responsibilities. It's important all in.
you start your career
My main function is to make sure that from a revenue standpoint relative to ticket sales, first and foremost, we are doing everything necessary to have success. I have spent many years here in Minnesota and have understood the marketplace. I have understood what has made us successful throughout these years. My role at this point from a leadership standpoint is identifying the processes that we need to have in play for all 3 teams, spending time with the leadership groups within those 3 teams, and making sure that they are supported and that they have the resources they need to be successful.
The other side of this is making sure that I'm connecting and removing barriers across all functions of our teams. To be successful from a revenue and sales standpoint, you need collaboration and teamwork. You need to be able to work well with other departments within marketing, business intelligence, PR, etc. For me, I'm at my best when I can take what the goal is and spend time with those key stakeholders. All of us get on the same page so that when we walk out of that room, everybody's very clear on what their role is and what the objective is.
To be successful from a revenue and sales standpoint, you need collaboration and teamwork.
When you ask what this role is, there's a little bit of me that still likes to get my hands dirty and understand what we are doing on the phone, what are the talking points, and what are the trainings like, but for the most part, I'm trying to stay out of that day-to-day and allow the leaders to do that. I make sure that I'm there for the leaders in terms of support and that they are in a position to be successful.
You said it, too. You've been there for many years. In that tenure, you've rebuilt the organization. In every area of the country, there are certain ways you sell. In Philly, you are probably a little bit more direct. People don't believe that, but there is a regionality to how you sell. In Minnesota, it's interesting. The flight factor is high.
Sometimes, you have to work hard as a salesperson to read if somebody is interested or is being nice to you and showing people skills. You did a phenomenal job there also. You've gone through a huge capital spend at the arena. We have to realize that for someone at Jake's level, there is a B2C element to what his revenue teams do. There's a crossover, a big B2B element. The strategies there are different and so is the process. How many people report to you?
I have 76 total direct reports. As you look at a couple of areas of our business, the Timberwolves side of our business is healthy. We have had some incredible success on the floor over the last couple of years that has met what we were building on the sales and service side and created this perfect storm. We have had to add people to handle all the accounts we have added. When you look at that, we have had to expand and figure out how that process would work now that we have multiple accounts and almost 11,000 FSEs.
When you look at the Lynx side of the business, you are seeing some explosive growth. The league itself has seen explosive growth. Our tremendous Minnesota Lynx has as well. You have another scenario where we went to the WNBA finals. We have seen some incredible increases across our FSE numbers and single-game ticket sales numbers. Being able to capitalize on that has forced us to ensure we have the right staffing level. We have expanded our Minnesota Lynx staff and are excited about what we are ready to accomplish on that side of things.
Down in Des Moines, the G League and what that team has done is they have continued to lead in revenue and sales. My role there is more about making sure I can be a good consultant for those folks and making sure that we, as the mothership, can be there for them, whether that’s providing resources or expertise.
I'm excited about the group we have. Part of my role is also overseeing our fan experience areas and a lot of the arena operations we manage on a game-by-game basis. That area of the business is also critical as we continue to grow the fan base. We have seen some incredible spikes in our single-game ticket numbers. With that, you have to make sure that the holistic customer and fan experience on game nights is a good one, or else, you could lose them quickly.
That part has also been a lot of fun for me to dive into because, as a grizzled ticket sales vet, you’d sell the tickets and service the account. When you start to look at how their ingress and egress to the building works, what their technology experience is like with our app in the arena, and what the F&B experience is, we have worked hard to ensure this entire experience at every level is one that folks enjoy and that keeps them coming back game after game.
Jake’s Career And Professional Journey
He has all these revenue streams from three different teams plus other revenue streams from in-stadium that he’s looking to play out. You’re a bit like a traffic cop also. You’re coordinating, strategizing, and keeping the momentum going. Where did you start your career? After college, where did you go first?
t’s a fun trip for me to talk about this because I grew up in Philadelphia. I don't know if the eighteen-year-old Jake Vernon would have ever thought he’d be sitting here in a C-level position. I was hoping to get through college and figure it out from there. I’m blessed. I have had a lot of incredible people help me along the way.
I went to Xavier University in Cincinnati and had an incredible four years there. I got lucky with an internship in Cincinnati. I got an unpaid public relations internship with the Cincinnati Reds. On my first day on the job, we had some crazy stuff happen. The umpire, John McSherry, tragically passed away behind the plate. I remember that day and the stress that came with it.
It was my first day on the job. It was a tragedy and something that baseball remembers quite often. Looking back, it opened my eyes that you never know what this business from a day-to-day point of view could bring. I didn't know it then, but it set the stage for my career being ready for the moment, whatever that moment may be. I got a job with the Indianapolis Indians, a AAA baseball team in Indianapolis.
I didn’t know that. I had no clue.
It was a wild experience. I was a PR intern. When something like that happens, the phone lights up. We were a small staff. I was 1 of 3 people. I stayed until about midnight that night, answering calls and reading off a statement we had written. I remember walking out that night. My boss and colleagues were exhausted from the day but we were playing a game again the next day. You had to go home, recharge, and come back. That was a big learning experience for me. I was 1 of the first 5 employees for the Indiana Fever. The Pacers had acquired and earned the right to get the Indiana Fever as an expansion WNBA team.
What did you get hired at? What was that job when you went over the Fever? I remember that's when I first met you. That's when I first learned about the WNBA.
I got hired as a ticket sales account exec. There were three of us. It's hilarious to think. If you’d bring an expansion team now, you'd probably hire 25 salespeople and a bunch of managers, but there were 3 of us. They handed us a bunch of leads, a bunch of folks who had said they were interested in potentially coming to games.
I will never forget this. They were building a new arena and the offices weren't ready yet, so they put us in a conference room. There were three of us across from each other, making calls. It was loud. There was another new employee that day. His name was David Morway. His role was assistant general manager. Our assistant GM was sitting in the same conference room. You have had some hilarious experiences throughout this whole career.
How long did you do that?
I did that for two seasons, and then I got promoted to a premium sales role with the Indiana Pacers as my full-time role. Back then, we sold everything. There were no real specialties. Our Pacer sales team sold Fever, and then our Fever team sold Pacers.
What year was this?
It was from '99 to about 2002. I spent a couple of years as a dedicated Pacer ticket sales rep. I give this guy credit a lot. You know him well. He is an industry titan as well. Doug Dawson got hired as our vice president. We were at a time there when the industry was starting to expand the sales staff. To drive ticket revenue, they knew they needed to hire and strategize differently.
Doug came in and laid the foundation for me to dive into processing people. I remember back then, it was bang out the phone calls, go have the meetings, and go close deals. Doug took a different approach. I remember vividly the conversation he and I had in his office. He was like, "Jake, you could be great at this. You could be a great leader. People tend to gravitate to you. They listen to you. If you want to do that, these are the steps that we need to take."
Quite frankly, I went back to my desk thinking, “I'm not sure I want to change my ways. I like making all the money I'm making from selling tickets and doing what I'm doing.” The more I thought about it, he was right. It was time to explore that side. Honestly, I enjoyed it. It created an opportunity for me to build off of my strengths which were my relationship skills and my ability to have tougher conversations but have them come from the heart, hold people accountable, and be creative. That's part of this. We tend to forget that to be successful in these roles, you have to make sure you are rethinking things on a consistent basis.
Background And Experiences As A Salesperson
You have the relationship skills and you are thinking at the moment. Your critical problem-solving skills are off the charts. Even working with you over the years, your ability to dial into the problem and say, "This is what we are going to work on," stands out. You said you like to get your hands dirty earlier. I know that for a fact. As a salesperson, because I don't want people to miss this, how were you as a salesperson? How were you able to manage? Where were you on the board?
Anybody who's competitive and anybody that has success in what they do, you've got to have a little bit of ego attached to that. I always believed in myself. As a kid from Philadelphia, for me to be successful, I knew I had to be the only person in the room who believed I could do it. There could be other people in the room, but the chip on my shoulder was always about, “I have got to go do this. It's me against everybody.”
As a salesperson, I took it that way. I literally would come in every day, go to my desk, get in my own mind and environment, and go. As a salesperson, what I leaned on was making sure I had all the information, I understood what you were trying to get accomplished, and I understood your business. I wanted to understand how we could be connected.
I'm a big believer in saying, "You work in this industry. I know so-and-so over here. Do you know them?" Making that deeper connection very early on in the conversation was important to me.
Once I got that conversation going with individuals, the trust was there. They knew that I was always going to make sure that whatever business we were going to do was going to be good for the customer and good for the business. That was how I sold it. Some of my managers at times wanted me to be a little more in the process. I tended to get onto the edges a little bit more.
Was it more like a networker?
Yes. I believed in the process, for sure, but I also think there were times to play on the art side of this rather than the science side. I was good at that. I could navigate those conversations. When I ask my reps how things are going or what their process is like, anybody who tells me, "I don't use a script," I always pause because everyone has a version of a script. It doesn't mean it has to be written down as this very mechanical thing.
They have something guiding them.
W within those guidelines, you can do whatever you want. I was that salesperson. Doug would probably answer that I could be a pain in the ass to manage because I had ideas. I was super competitive. I wanted to be number one. If things weren't going the way I wanted them to go, I would work harder and maybe be in his office more, telling them what I thought we should be doing to have success.
You've never been afraid to give your opinion.
I believe in my opinions, that's for sure.
Rising To The Managerial Role
If I'm thinking of a younger version of you, which I probably knew closer to '05, '06, or '07, you were willing to debate. There’s no question. You were in sales. Doug comes in and he gives you a shot to start to manage. You said, "I want to sell," or "I want to do this." What's that first management role?
I managed our season ticket sales team. They were all folks who had been in the business and had been on the team for a few years. Honestly, I was more of a peer leader and friend to a lot of those folks. When I took that step into management, that part was hard. It's something I tell young managers all the time as I promote people in very similar situations, “You have to separate yourself a little bit,” and that can be hard. These are people that you tend to hang out with. This is a business that's a little more like a family than a workplace at times.
When you get promoted to managerial positions, you have to separate yourself a little bit from your team.
For me, I struggled a little bit with separation where I have to be able to manage you during the workday, and then I can't necessarily go have a beer with you after work. I learned that there are times you can do it and there are things you can do to make sure you are building that relationship with your employees. I also learned that, at some point, you have to be the manager and have to be the boss. Those tougher conversations are more effective when there's some separation there.
Over time, that came into play. I learned and understood how to do that. It goes away. I always say that after the first year, people start to view you as the manager. In that early part, they are like, “That's my buddy Jake, my colleague, or work friend.” It's a tougher situation that most younger leaders have to go through to be successful.
In that first management job, you are trying to separate Jake the friend as opposed to Jake the boss. How long were you in that role, and what did it look like from there?
I was in that role for a couple of years, got promoted to oversee group ticket sales and season ticket sales, and then got promoted to oversee premium. At that point, Doug had left to go to the Cowboys project with Legends and I got promoted to his role of vice president of ticket sales and service. By then, I was starting to understand how to develop people. I was starting to understand how to make sure the process was being taught. There was a transfer of skills happening on the sales floor between managers.
It's interesting because when you came into sales, you were on the periphery of that. You even said it earlier. You said, “I was more art than I was science,” but you started to see value in the process itself.
What you start to understand is managing a larger workforce, managing different personalities, and managing up to a leadership team, you couldn't do all that without some sort of structure and some sort of process that you believed in. For me, as a leader, I was totally different from what I was as a seller.
You were trying to scale the philosophy.
I would not be able to do what we needed as a business without that scalability and without that ability to understand a teachable process. At that point, when I got promoted, I started to dive into what is the leadership and development of people and what the staff needs to be successful long-term. I was able to lean on my experience as a sales rep and understand what I needed and how I developed into a leader and a manager.
I asked myself, “How do I help these folks accelerate that process?” Everyone is on a different timeline, but if I could jump in and begin to not only teach sales skills and customer service skills but also teach leadership skills and how to manage people when you do get promoted, then we would be creating some shortcuts that most don't get.
What comes out here is the most interesting philosophy you said. What I’m hearing is you said, “If I'm going to scale this and create some consistency, I have to have a defined process, a predictable process, and predictable results and I'm going to have to build it through people because I can't do it myself.” At that point, you have become VP. You had 40 to 50 people reporting up to you.
I had 45 staff members. You start overseeing a budget line that's multiple millions of dollars and start understanding the impact you have on the organization. Ticket sales and sponsorship drive the ship and drive the business. There was a moment when I had some amazing people around me. Doug was a great leader as well as Ben Milsom, who I know you know, and Kevin Frattura.
We had an incredible group of leaders and we all learned together. When they all went their separate ways and it was just me, there were some moments of insecurity. I had to make sure that I shared and talked about what was going on with other leaders outside of the organization. It was a heavy burden. I was excited about the opportunity.
It was a newer venue, too.
The other part of this is that we went from a team that went to the NBA Finals and the Conference Finals pretty much every year. We had the Malice at the Palace happen in '04. That derailed the entire business. The revenue streams and ticket sales took a huge hit. At that moment, as a young VP in 2007 and 2008, this was a reclamation project all of a sudden. This went from a brand-new building that sold out every game to we couldn’t get more than 8,000 or 9,000 people into the games.
That pressed on me to not only be creative but to also make sure I kept my best people around me. That's where you see staff members look for other opportunities when it gets tough like that. The only way I was going to survive right there was to make sure that I had a great relationship with my best people and that they understood the long term was going to be good for them.
One of the things I also noticed about you then is you were doing a lot of alternative things to drive business. You got entrepreneurial. At this point in the history of sports, you were running a lot of cocktail parties and events. The president of the team at that point was Larry Bird. If you know Larry Bird, you had a lot of interaction with him. It's interesting. I hadn't thought about that. You were doing some innovative things that I didn't see other teams doing. This was before 2010. They weren't doing anything in the mid-2000s. They weren't doing it between 2010 and 2015.
You are dead on that we had to be creative and do things differently because we weren't going to be able to call 100 people a day and make this successful. We had to get in front of people, tell our story, and get people to believe that the long term of this was going to be a lot of fun and successful. I give a lot of credit to Larry Bird, Rick Fuson, and Jim Morris because when we talked about these ideas and said, "Can we start to use you guys to tell our story? It's not going to be powerful enough with just the staff." They jumped in with both feet.
I have told this story. I have been at Larry Bird's house with 200 season ticket holders and 100 prospects. I have had Larry come into suite nights and spend time with customers. We have gone to Herb Simon's house. We had to do these things. Now, it is the norm in our industry, but back then, there were a lot of times when people would call me and go, "Are you seriously hosting a party with Larry Bird?" I said, “Yes.”
I attended those cocktail parties. We were doing business with the Cavs. They are running off the hottest ticket run. You guys had lost all those great players and those great battles with the New York Knicks and stuff like that. You guys have figured it out. The other thing you have to remember, too, is Jake is in the small market at this point. Indy's not big. If you mess up one relationship, everybody knows about it. Indy is where you went to high school. It's like Cincinnati.
It's a basketball state.
They know the game.
You also have to understand that you are competing against the Indiana University basketball program and Purdue's basketball program. There were other options out there. We weren't the only game in town. It also synced up with Peyton Manning's run with the Colts.
It's not like you were the only ticket. You had a football team.
To be relevant within all that clutter, you had to do things differently. The other thing, and you were there, is those sales events allowed you to tell your story. Getting people to buy in on the relationship that we could have and getting them to understand how this could be mutually beneficial wasn't going to happen over the phone. We are in sports. The tough part is folks tend to look at the product on the court first. They don't look at the other opportunities that exist.
I had some sales exec who worked for the Golden State or something. He goes, "I have this." I said, "With all due respect, if you take some of these winners, I could hire first-year nursing students to sell some of those products when you are hot." I have nothing against any of those. When you are hot, you are hot. It's easier to sell. Remember, you think sports sells. It doesn't sell. It has to be sold. Nobody understands that. If you are an Eagles fan, you can't get a ticket. What about the other 29 teams that have to move tickets or other revenue streams like partnerships?
There are always dollars to be had out there.
No doubt.
I also agree with you on this. What I also learned during my experience in Indiana, which worked well for me in Minnesota, is things change on a dime. At ‘06, we were having incredible success, and all of a sudden, one turn of events happened. There was a fight in the stands and your business completely crumbled.
That didn't land very well in Indianapolis.
Not at all. That did not land well anywhere.
That's true.
As I look at our business, you have to be prepared and build a structure, a process, and the staff to handle something like that. If something bad happens or a trade happens, your business changes. You can look across the landscape of sports over the last few months. You are going to see teams that have performed on the court and are having tremendous success. You are also going to see some teams that have underperformed or had something happen to their business that has drastically affected them. My goal was to always make sure that it is as even-keeled as it possibly can be and that you are on that flat line as much as you can. When you play in those peaks and valleys, it's tough on the staff and the process.
Starting An Outsourced Sales Consultant Business
I want to bring something up. In your run there as VP, what year does it end? You then take a turn in your career and decide to go in a whole different direction, which ties into the whole entrepreneurial side. I want to make sure we hit on that. Your run as a VP was how long?
It was about a five-year run.
There are two things I want to mention here. You said early on that you always bet on yourself, that confident, cocky Philly. When I was bringing up all the different special events you were doing to drive tickets and you had a little bit of entrepreneurship, you decided to leave and start your own thing. You started your own business. You take everything you were managing and say, "I can turn this into its own business." I remember talking to you then.
We were almost business partners.
We talked a couple of times. At least we trusted each other.
We could have taken over the world, two Philly guys.
No doubt. We were both a little undercapitalized but we were running. Tell everybody about that. You decided to roll the dice on yourself and start a business.
This was an idea that I played around with for a couple of years. I talked about this with Ben Milsom, Doug, and Kevin in a meeting in 2005 or 2006. I started talking about, "We are good at what we do. Should we be doing something outside of these four walls and understanding how we could help other businesses and other sports teams?"
I left the Pacers. I decided I wanted to try and take a stab at this outsourced sales consultant business. There were some businesses out there doing it at Learfield and IMG at the time that were helping colleges and universities outsource their sales functions and create sales teams that could go out and sell tickets for them.
On the other side of that, it happened to sync up with the lockout. I knew the NBA lockout was coming, and I knew there was going to be an opportunity where teams were going to turn the spigots off a little bit and they were potentially going to lay off employees. When they had to rev that back up, were they going to be in a position to hire and sell what they needed to sell for a shortened season? It all synced up together for me.
It was an incredible experience. I loved it. Waking up and suddenly being responsible for your family, your mortgage payment, and all that with no steady income was exhilarating and also scary at the same time. I enjoyed the idea of going out there, doing the business, and building the business on my own. You know this as a business owner. You have to understand employee taxes and how to do payroll. There were a lot of other things I didn’t know.
There was a lot of risk there. I always admired that about you. You did that for 2 or 3 years.
Three years. I went out and got some great deals. Butler University was one of my first deals. They were coming off a national championship run with Brad Stevens and needed to start to monetize that success. In their own words, they weren’t equipped to go out and hire twenty salespeople. We did some big numbers for them from a corporate partnership and ticket sales standpoint.
Charlotte Bobcats at the time needed help. I got a gig with the Minnesota Timberwolves, the Indianapolis Motor Speedway, and the Cincinnati Reds. All of a sudden, my name was starting to circulate. I would get phone calls. I had to start turning down deals because the deal wasn’t going to be fruitful enough or it wasn’t something I was willing to put the energy into.
You talked a little bit about risk. You are a problem solver. What did you add to your leadership strategy there? What did you realize about yourself that you still carry through?
Having an owner mentality is much different than an employee slash senior leader mentality. As senior leaders in a sports team, you've got to be good stewards of the team and the franchise. You know this. It's your money. It's you balancing the checkbook every day. For me, there was a level of respect for the business that I don't think I had prior to that.
Running your own business is so much different than being in corporate leadership. You are balancing your checkbook every day.
You want to take your staff out to a happy hour or want to go out and do a sales event somewhere. When you work for a team or work for a business, it's part of the budget. All of a sudden, that budget is your money. You have to start to understand this ownership mentality. It's what I always talked about. You start to understand what it's like to own something rather than work at something. The biggest growth piece for me was starting to understand what that looked like. When I did take this role with the Minnesota Timberwolves, I was much better suited for leadership because I had gone through some of those things with my own company.
I never asked you this before. Did the business you were doing with your own business with Minnesota create a pathway for you to the Timberwolves?
Yeah. I had a great relationship with our COO, Ryan Tanke. He and I talked when I owned my own business. He was in the same predicament that I thought most teams would be. He said, “We don't have the staff yet. We'd love to hire you.” I said, “You came to the call center that I had in Indianapolis.” I had this call center with up to twenty salespeople working there. I said, “We could dole out different projects.” We did a project for the Timberwolves. That started the conversations with Ryan.
I miss the team environment. You and I have talked about this. When you have success as a consultant, it only scratches so much of that itch. I always tell this story. I love Butler. They are amazing people. We helped them sell a game out against Gonzaga on a Saturday afternoon. If that was the Pacers, I would have taken my staff out and we would have celebrated. We would have had this huge celebration. No disrespect, they are great people, but I remember there was this, “Great job. Thanks for all your help.” I miss that team environment.
It’s the camaraderie that's built into it. There's something that when you are a hired gun or when you are a Hessian sometimes, it's hard. There's no doubt. I understand that.
That was when Ryan and I started talking about potentially the future of my business and where I wanted to go. At the time, there were starting to be some people looking to acquire the business that I had built. It made sense at the time. I was ready to get back into the sports side of this and on the team side. I trusted Ryan Tanke and understood what he was looking for.
If I were to make this type of move, I would have never done it for a job or for a leader that I was unsure about. I needed to make sure whatever that move was going to be that it was going to be something that I could be myself and that we could bring in the processes and ideas. You know this. You see it all the time. There are a lot of people that get hired into the wrong situation. It doesn't mean they are bad at their job. It's their core functions and their skillset that don't fit into the culture. I wanted to make sure that happened.
I was doing something and a younger person reached out. She was working with the Ravens. I had done a talk there. I always give my number out to anyone. She goes, “You mentioned some organizations not to work for. Why?” She asked me a couple of questions. I said, “You want to go work for the right leader. I'd look at you as if you were my own kid. You've got to be in the right situation. Culture's critical.”
Valuable Advice On Sales Leadership
With that, you land back in Minnesota. I'm going to take a couple of things. Number one, bet on yourself. You are a quick problem solver. You always like to roll it up. You proved it again when you started your own business. You were like, “I had to go out and win the business myself.” You were winning the contracts and managing the company. There are two sales there. It's sale 1 and sale 2. It's like, “Go win the business. Now, we have to go execute,” and you’ve got to go resell this other product. There are several things going on.
I joke all the time. The scariest moment is when someone says, “We have a deal. Now go sell the tickets.” I was like, I got to go do what I said I was going to do.”
Be careful what you wish for. You are an entrepreneur. You need to make a payroll. Anybody that's an entrepreneur knows this. The scariest thing in the world is realizing, “I got to make my people's payroll. I might not get a payroll,” especially when you are starting off. 99% of all businesses fail after year one. You went the distance and then decided to exit yourself.
When you look back at your rise from VP to chief sales officer with multiple properties, what are three things you can say about your leadership? I also want you to give some advice to salespeople. As a strategic sales leader with a big group underneath you and multiple properties and multiple revenue streams, give three philosophies about your leadership or strategy. Go.
First for me is that I got to be present. I need to be present for my leaders but also be present for the staff. I take a lot of pride in knowing what's happening in all areas of the business. To do that, you can't ask for an email to be updated every day or every week. You have to be in conversations, in people's offices, and have robust one-on-ones with your managers and understand what they are up against. That, to me, provides a sense of security. It is a sense of like, “I can do this as long as we are all doing this together.”
You never in training have dropped your kids off at daycare. There are a lot of leaders out there who when they train their people, it's like parents dropping their kids off at daycare. They’re like, “Go have fun with the trainer.”
If I'm going to set the expectation, when you come in and visit, which is some of my favorite two days, I always say, “I expect this from the staff.” They need to show up ready, show up early, and make sure they are engaging. If I'm asking that of the staff, then I better be doing the same. That's the part I enjoy when you visit. I get to dive in on this too for a couple of days.
If you want your staff to show up ready, come to work early, and always engaged, you better be doing the same.
That's the epitome of what you are saying. You are present. What you are saying is, “I'm present in all kinds of things. I'm in boots-on-the-ground mode.” What's your second thing?
The second piece for me is when you look at it from a strategy standpoint, you’ve got to be buttoned up in terms of what the game plan is. What are you trying to get accomplished, and how are we going to do that? For us to be successful in these roles in our business, you've got to run very comprehensive and successful sales campaigns.
That doesn't happen by you coming in on a Monday and going, “We are now selling suites. Everybody go get it.” That requires time with business intelligence. That requires finding the right leads and spending time with the training so that the staff understands what we are trying to accomplish. I'm a big believer in that strategy part. I spend probably more time with my managers around the strategy and the plan than I do when the execution happens because I trust at that point that the plan is good and all they have to do is to go execute.
My third one is probably something I have learned from a lot of different leaders over the years. It is to have fun. I keep talking about Philadelphia. I grew up in a low to middle-class family. My mom and dad worked their tails off every day at jobs that they didn't like and that they didn't love getting up for. When I think about the culture I want here, I know it's going to be difficult at times. Sales can be difficult at times, but we are going to have fun when we do this, whether that's sales contests, spending time with each other, or doing community service. We are going to have a culture that cares about each other, lifts each other up, and also has a lot of fun together.
The folks that I work with out here and some of my leaders are how I gain my energy every day. I say this all the time. They uplift me. When I'm having a tough day, I walk the sales floor because I know I can have some fun, I'm going to smile, and I'm going to enjoy each other's company. For me, the fun part is real. I don't want to sell insurance. No disrespect to the folks that sell insurance, but I want to be able to look down at our practice facility, and watch the Timberwolves or the Minnesota Lynx practice. Who gets to do that? I look back at eighteen-year-old me. If you told me this was my job, I wouldn't have cared what you were paying me. I'd take it all day, every day.
The advice to the salespeople is this. I want to say it for you. Show up ready. What was the other one?
Show up early and be ready to engage.
That's the best advice. That's the most succinct advice I have heard for a sales team in forever. I'm taking that one as your advice.
I'm not complicated. I'm usually pretty simple when it comes to these things.
Answering Rapid-Fire Questions
That's why you've been doing this for so long. Last couple of questions. These are the ones I ask everybody. You are going to get a big deal done or get your people ready for a big deal. What song are you playing in your head? What's that go-to song? What's in your head?
A lot of people are going to make fun of me on this one, but it is what it is. I grew up a huge Bon Jovi fan. I could pull out some old photos to prove it. It is Livin’ on a Prayer every time.
It’s such a go-to. The whole song has power chords. It's the whole thing.
Not to be too dramatic about a sale, but if you go into this battle with the idea of, “This is who I am and how we are going to do,” it speaks to me that way.
There is nothing wrong with that. I haven't heard that one for a while. It's on my playlist.
My problem is it's going to date me. If my kids see this, they are going to kill me. They would have wanted some Kendrick Lamar or something a little more modern, but I can't.
Mine's right around the same time. It’s This or That by Black Sheep. It’s early ‘90s. I got it. What are we going to do about it? Second question. Your kids are a little older. If you had a niece or nephew at age six, seven, or eight and they go, “Uncle Jake, what does success mean?" You say to them what? They’re six, seven, or eight-year-olds, so it can't be this complex thing. Go.
It's pretty simple. You try your best and let the results be what they are. I wish I could go back to some of my experiences with my kids. I put too much pressure on what the results were and didn't celebrate the work that they put in to try to be successful. When you look at these kids at those ages, it’s like, “Enjoy it. Celebrate the work. Celebrate that you tried your best and move on.” We were told that all the time when we were kids. I probably didn't believe it that much because I hate to lose more than I love to win, but that's what I would tell them.
I'm with you on that one. I hate to lose. I will do more not to lose a thing than I ever did to win.
Nothing makes me more angry. Anybody who has played pickup basketball with me knows that doesn’t ring more true.
There are a couple of rumors out. Your name has come up in a couple of them.
Don't listen too much to what someone like Jake Reynolds, Ryan Davenport, Ben Milsom, or Jason Howard say about me.
There's some Scotty O'Neil, Chad Estes, and you stuff out there.
Those guys aren't sweethearts on the court either.
Anybody that's competitive is not. Last question. Besides my book, if you had to gift a book to somebody, like a new leader or something, what would you gift to them?
I would probably say The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People.
I still go to it.
I gave it to my kids. When they were like 15 and 13, I said, “You guys need to read this.” I don't know that they quite got it. My older son since then has probably understood a little bit more of it.
Philosophically, I go back to that book when I write anything to myself. I agree.
I use it with our staff people all the time. A lot of times, people come to me and ask me questions about how they should handle certain situations or how they should develop. I usually talk about that book because it can help you identify where your shortcomings are and how you could handle them.
It gives you that path. I was writing something in my journal where I laid out all my roles. The book clearly says your life exists inchief sales officer separate roles. It goes from inner to outer. How do you deal with yourself first and then worry about how you deal with everybody else? I couldn't agree more. It's my most tattered book.
It's also easy to get through.
It's not a hard read.
It's a quick read.
It's comprehensive. It's not light. It's heavy.
If you look at the one I have, I have highlights all over it because I go back to it all the time. It's one of those that I always pull back out. I don't read a lot, but when I do read, it needs to be something that helps me in terms of understanding where I'm at and how it can help me be better. That book has always done that.
Episode Wrap-up And Closing Words
I love it. I have been waiting for this for a long time. I’m pretty sure you and I could riff a bit more. This is one of my longer ones because you and I are rapping.
We can easily do it for a while. No doubt.
Thanks for being on. This was a great interview.
Thank you.
Thanks again, Jake Vernon, Chief Sales Officer of Timberwolves, Lynx, and Wolves. Let's go.